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	<title>Comments on: Remembrance of things past</title>
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	<pubDate>Sun, 12 Feb 2012 15:54:10 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Tom Ronayne</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-7094</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Ronayne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 May 2009 10:47:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-7094</guid>
		<description>Rightly, Brendan has emphasised the Keynesian story (with a supplement of emigration) in understanding the rapid fall in unemployment from the mid-1990s to 2000 and the unlikely repeat of those conditions for sometime, if ever, in the near future.  What he will also remember in researching the lost times of rapidly falling unemployment and trying to identify the lessons to respond to the present crisis is that the composition of the unemployed then was very different from what it is now.  Then we had a relatively homogeneous group - poorly educated and low to semi-skilled men, often living in public accommodation - particularly among the long-term unemployed.  It was towards this group that many specific labour market policies were directed (e.g., Social Employment Scheme now Community Employment) and policy initiatives such as the establishment of the area-based partnership companies were taken.

Now unemployment is different.  However, before commenting on the composition of the unemployed it should be noted that right through the boom years one group of social welfare recipients increased yoy.  Recipients of disability related payments increased from just over 153,000 in 2000 to a current estimate of 230,000.  As a proportion of the labour force, recipients of disability related payments increased from 8.6% of the labour force in 2000 to an estimated 10.3% in 2008.  Many of these are long-term recipients.  The reason I present these figures is that the path to receipt of a disability and also to a carer’s related payment was often eased as a result of being considered “hard to place” or “not progression ready” by the national employment service (FÁS / DSFA) in the context of the Employment Action Plan Process (EAP).  Conclusion, there is a large amount of hidden unemployment in the disability stats and many of these recipients are more similar in profile to the long-term unemployed of the 1990s.  This shows through in the current composition of the unemployed.

Turning the composition of the unemployed now as compared to them.  While accurate figures are not yet available, data from the DSFA suggest that over 40% of persons currently unemployed have at least a post Leaving Certificate / Third Level qualification and that approximately 20% have at most Junior certificate qualifications – more than a reverse of the 1990s.  Second, in April 09, one in five (20.2%) of the unemployed on the Live Register were non-Irish nationals.  This compares to almost 0% in the 1990s.  Third, a high proportion of current recipients of unemployment related welfare payments are persons in work – almost one in six (16.2%) based on Live Register figures for April 09.  Again, different from the 1990s.

All agree that preventing the flow into long-term employment must be a central feature of labour market policy.  In the likely absence of an increase in aggregate demand the key challenge, however, is not just responding to “unemployment” in an undifferentiated manner, but addressing the very different employment situations present among persons on the Live Register as well as the hidden unemployed in receipt of disability related payments.  One think is clear, however: the policy package and institutional structures put in place to address “unemployment” in the past - and largely still with us - are unlikely to work in present circumstances both on the demand and supply sides.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rightly, Brendan has emphasised the Keynesian story (with a supplement of emigration) in understanding the rapid fall in unemployment from the mid-1990s to 2000 and the unlikely repeat of those conditions for sometime, if ever, in the near future.  What he will also remember in researching the lost times of rapidly falling unemployment and trying to identify the lessons to respond to the present crisis is that the composition of the unemployed then was very different from what it is now.  Then we had a relatively homogeneous group - poorly educated and low to semi-skilled men, often living in public accommodation - particularly among the long-term unemployed.  It was towards this group that many specific labour market policies were directed (e.g., Social Employment Scheme now Community Employment) and policy initiatives such as the establishment of the area-based partnership companies were taken.</p>
<p>Now unemployment is different.  However, before commenting on the composition of the unemployed it should be noted that right through the boom years one group of social welfare recipients increased yoy.  Recipients of disability related payments increased from just over 153,000 in 2000 to a current estimate of 230,000.  As a proportion of the labour force, recipients of disability related payments increased from 8.6% of the labour force in 2000 to an estimated 10.3% in 2008.  Many of these are long-term recipients.  The reason I present these figures is that the path to receipt of a disability and also to a carer’s related payment was often eased as a result of being considered “hard to place” or “not progression ready” by the national employment service (FÁS / DSFA) in the context of the Employment Action Plan Process (EAP).  Conclusion, there is a large amount of hidden unemployment in the disability stats and many of these recipients are more similar in profile to the long-term unemployed of the 1990s.  This shows through in the current composition of the unemployed.</p>
<p>Turning the composition of the unemployed now as compared to them.  While accurate figures are not yet available, data from the DSFA suggest that over 40% of persons currently unemployed have at least a post Leaving Certificate / Third Level qualification and that approximately 20% have at most Junior certificate qualifications – more than a reverse of the 1990s.  Second, in April 09, one in five (20.2%) of the unemployed on the Live Register were non-Irish nationals.  This compares to almost 0% in the 1990s.  Third, a high proportion of current recipients of unemployment related welfare payments are persons in work – almost one in six (16.2%) based on Live Register figures for April 09.  Again, different from the 1990s.</p>
<p>All agree that preventing the flow into long-term employment must be a central feature of labour market policy.  In the likely absence of an increase in aggregate demand the key challenge, however, is not just responding to “unemployment” in an undifferentiated manner, but addressing the very different employment situations present among persons on the Live Register as well as the hidden unemployed in receipt of disability related payments.  One think is clear, however: the policy package and institutional structures put in place to address “unemployment” in the past - and largely still with us - are unlikely to work in present circumstances both on the demand and supply sides.</p>
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		<title>By: Con</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-7082</link>
		<dc:creator>Con</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 May 2009 08:47:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-7082</guid>
		<description>@tomás, not arguing with the main thrust of your point, but most of the fall in unemployment predated the construction boom. It can more plausibly be attributed to the direct and indirect employment effects of rapid growth in exporting industries, which lasted up to around 2001. The end of this period of growth overlapped with the start of the construction boom, which I date to around 1998, when construction employment breached 8% of total employment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@tomás, not arguing with the main thrust of your point, but most of the fall in unemployment predated the construction boom. It can more plausibly be attributed to the direct and indirect employment effects of rapid growth in exporting industries, which lasted up to around 2001. The end of this period of growth overlapped with the start of the construction boom, which I date to around 1998, when construction employment breached 8% of total employment.</p>
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		<title>By: Pat Donnelly</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-7069</link>
		<dc:creator>Pat Donnelly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 May 2009 02:18:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-7069</guid>
		<description>@ tomas MacAmloaibh
Spot on! It was then that they should have realized that fiscal policy needed to be tighter, given all the cheap money and lack of CB control. But our politicians could see that re-election was more important and getting the voters drunk on inflation of money supply was essential.....to them. And FG seem to be trying to buy votes also. The only way out is a national government, with honest people participating. The good thing about a depression is that the sooner that people sober up, the sooner they get things working, but at a newer level. It takes years, see Iceland.

I see Bob Chapman is suggesting that the Obama tax haven attack is a negotiation with USA corporations on other issues and may not be as biting as feared.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ tomas MacAmloaibh<br />
Spot on! It was then that they should have realized that fiscal policy needed to be tighter, given all the cheap money and lack of CB control. But our politicians could see that re-election was more important and getting the voters drunk on inflation of money supply was essential&#8230;..to them. And FG seem to be trying to buy votes also. The only way out is a national government, with honest people participating. The good thing about a depression is that the sooner that people sober up, the sooner they get things working, but at a newer level. It takes years, see Iceland.</p>
<p>I see Bob Chapman is suggesting that the Obama tax haven attack is a negotiation with USA corporations on other issues and may not be as biting as feared.</p>
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		<title>By: tomás MacAmloaibh</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-7062</link>
		<dc:creator>tomás MacAmloaibh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 May 2009 20:42:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-7062</guid>
		<description>Jaysus, I'm not economist but the graph's unemployment profile has to correlate closely with the beginning of the building boom in the late 1990's and follows the prolonged building binge until it finally ends with the property bubble collapse.

Forget about all the macro-economic fulminations. Only one macro-economic factor mattered - Cheap Money. Whilst many property prices had double or tripled from the late 90's into the early period of the 2000-2001, our entry into the Euro, and the attendant cheap interest rates coupled with disastorous risk assesment by lenders, kept employment levels at unsustainable levels for years. Had the property bubble been checked our unemployment levels wouldn't have been 4%.

I'm far too polite to mention govt policy although I distinctly remember Harney's declarations during 2000 that immigration would skyrocket. Did the govt know that an era of cheap money was about to be unleashed on the Irish economy, and for once an Irish govt was well prepared for this eventuality? (No escape plan on the back end unfortunately.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jaysus, I&#8217;m not economist but the graph&#8217;s unemployment profile has to correlate closely with the beginning of the building boom in the late 1990&#8217;s and follows the prolonged building binge until it finally ends with the property bubble collapse.</p>
<p>Forget about all the macro-economic fulminations. Only one macro-economic factor mattered - Cheap Money. Whilst many property prices had double or tripled from the late 90&#8217;s into the early period of the 2000-2001, our entry into the Euro, and the attendant cheap interest rates coupled with disastorous risk assesment by lenders, kept employment levels at unsustainable levels for years. Had the property bubble been checked our unemployment levels wouldn&#8217;t have been 4%.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m far too polite to mention govt policy although I distinctly remember Harney&#8217;s declarations during 2000 that immigration would skyrocket. Did the govt know that an era of cheap money was about to be unleashed on the Irish economy, and for once an Irish govt was well prepared for this eventuality? (No escape plan on the back end unfortunately.)</p>
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		<title>By: Brendan Walsh</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-7042</link>
		<dc:creator>Brendan Walsh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 May 2009 14:56:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-7042</guid>
		<description>@John:  Yes, the Irish experience over the period 1998-2006 was all the more exceptional in that labour force participation rates rose, and not only among married women.  We did not resort as much as many continental countries to encouraging withdrawal from the labour force as a way of solving the unemployment crisis.  Nor did we encourage large-scale part-time working, á la hollandaise, to spread the available work around.  Unemployment rates fell, and employment rates rose, among most demographic groups and at most educational levels. The rise in the employment/population ratio made a significant contribution to the rise in living standards. There was also a marked narrowing of regional unemployment differentials. (I summarized these developments in a paper to SSISI May 2004 - http://www.tara.tcd.ie/handle/2262/2578).  I hope that we are saying “goodbye to all that” as the present crisis persists.  
Kevin Denny is right: The real challenge for our labour market policies now will be to prevent the recent surge in new unemployment from transiting to long-term unemployment, with all the negative implications that would have for the “natural” rate.   The indicators are not good:  the number of males of all ages who had been continuously registered as unemployed for one year or more increased by 23% between October 2007 and October 2008, and the number of males aged 20-24 in this category rose by 33%.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@John:  Yes, the Irish experience over the period 1998-2006 was all the more exceptional in that labour force participation rates rose, and not only among married women.  We did not resort as much as many continental countries to encouraging withdrawal from the labour force as a way of solving the unemployment crisis.  Nor did we encourage large-scale part-time working, á la hollandaise, to spread the available work around.  Unemployment rates fell, and employment rates rose, among most demographic groups and at most educational levels. The rise in the employment/population ratio made a significant contribution to the rise in living standards. There was also a marked narrowing of regional unemployment differentials. (I summarized these developments in a paper to SSISI May 2004 - <a href="http://www.tara.tcd.ie/handle/2262/2578" rel="nofollow">http://www.tara.tcd.ie/handle/2262/2578</a>).  I hope that we are saying “goodbye to all that” as the present crisis persists.<br />
Kevin Denny is right: The real challenge for our labour market policies now will be to prevent the recent surge in new unemployment from transiting to long-term unemployment, with all the negative implications that would have for the “natural” rate.   The indicators are not good:  the number of males of all ages who had been continuously registered as unemployed for one year or more increased by 23% between October 2007 and October 2008, and the number of males aged 20-24 in this category rose by 33%.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian Lucey</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-7038</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian Lucey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 May 2009 12:15:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-7038</guid>
		<description>George  Lee  can be found here 
http://www.tara.tcd.ie/handle/2262/2839
Summary 
"Conventional Keynesian or Classical macroeconomic theories must be considered inadequate to explain unemployment experiences such as the Irish one. Rigidities that one might associate with fixed contracts, or even adjustment costs in relation to prices or quantities, can hardly account for 17 years of rising unemployment. Indeed, surely such an upturn in conjunction with the apparent breakdown of the unemployment-inflation relationship serves to challenge the existence in Ireland of a stable "natural" rate of unemployment towards which the economy would gravitate and at which the level of inflation would remain constant. Within this context it is compelling to consider the existence of hysteresis in the labour market - i.e. the possibility that an increase in umemployment could have a direct impact on the natural rate or, to put it another way, that this year's equilibrium unemployment depends upon last year's actual rate. This paper examines the presence of hysteresis in the Irish labour market and in so doing enables estimates for the Irish natural rate of unemployment to be calculated. In all cases the long-term equilibrium rate of unemployment is considered to be the same as the natural rate. In Section 2 competing explanations for the hysteresis phenomenon, specifically physical capital, human capital and insider (union members)-outsider (non-union members) explanations are discussed. The following section briefly considers some econometric issues which may arise in the presence of hysteresis while Section 4 is concerned with some discrete time dynamics associated with the natural rate of unemployment. In Section 5 a procedure for testing for hysteresis is derived from the analysis in the preceding two sections. The paper then goes on to apply this test to Irish data and discusses the implications of the results. Since no such work has been done in an international context, it was not possible to compare the Irish outcome with that for other economies. In so far as possible mathematical considerations are dealt with in the appendices."

time to revisit this?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>George  Lee  can be found here<br />
<a href="http://www.tara.tcd.ie/handle/2262/2839" rel="nofollow">http://www.tara.tcd.ie/handle/2262/2839</a><br />
Summary<br />
&#8220;Conventional Keynesian or Classical macroeconomic theories must be considered inadequate to explain unemployment experiences such as the Irish one. Rigidities that one might associate with fixed contracts, or even adjustment costs in relation to prices or quantities, can hardly account for 17 years of rising unemployment. Indeed, surely such an upturn in conjunction with the apparent breakdown of the unemployment-inflation relationship serves to challenge the existence in Ireland of a stable &#8220;natural&#8221; rate of unemployment towards which the economy would gravitate and at which the level of inflation would remain constant. Within this context it is compelling to consider the existence of hysteresis in the labour market - i.e. the possibility that an increase in umemployment could have a direct impact on the natural rate or, to put it another way, that this year&#8217;s equilibrium unemployment depends upon last year&#8217;s actual rate. This paper examines the presence of hysteresis in the Irish labour market and in so doing enables estimates for the Irish natural rate of unemployment to be calculated. In all cases the long-term equilibrium rate of unemployment is considered to be the same as the natural rate. In Section 2 competing explanations for the hysteresis phenomenon, specifically physical capital, human capital and insider (union members)-outsider (non-union members) explanations are discussed. The following section briefly considers some econometric issues which may arise in the presence of hysteresis while Section 4 is concerned with some discrete time dynamics associated with the natural rate of unemployment. In Section 5 a procedure for testing for hysteresis is derived from the analysis in the preceding two sections. The paper then goes on to apply this test to Irish data and discusses the implications of the results. Since no such work has been done in an international context, it was not possible to compare the Irish outcome with that for other economies. In so far as possible mathematical considerations are dealt with in the appendices.&#8221;</p>
<p>time to revisit this?</p>
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		<title>By: Pat Donnelly</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-7035</link>
		<dc:creator>Pat Donnelly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 May 2009 10:37:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-7035</guid>
		<description>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/05/04/debtwatch-no-34-the-confidence-trick/

This is an interesting article, relating the movement in debt and gdp to employment changes in the Great Depression. USA, of course, but it would be interesting to see what the Irish experience was and is likely to be if the logic is valid that there is a close relationship. 
Not good news, of course, but the time for clear sight is now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/05/04/debtwatch-no-34-the-confidence-trick/" rel="nofollow">http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/05/04/debtwatch-no-34-the-confidence-trick/</a></p>
<p>This is an interesting article, relating the movement in debt and gdp to employment changes in the Great Depression. USA, of course, but it would be interesting to see what the Irish experience was and is likely to be if the logic is valid that there is a close relationship.<br />
Not good news, of course, but the time for clear sight is now.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Hunt</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-7007</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Hunt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 May 2009 11:34:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-7007</guid>
		<description>"A Keynesian story does better as an explanation - increases in aggregate demand fuelled by global growth, inward FDI, competiveness etc."

As Brian Lucey has pointed out, in a post on another thread, the only Keynesian shot that this Government can find in its locker is that President Obama's fiscal stimulus will work.  John's post (above) provides the context.  Surely it's time to craft our own Keynesian story to boost domestic demand while multipliers are in excess of unity and leakages are limited.

We have an appropriate independent regulatory model in key infrastructure and utlility sectors which, if applied properly (rather than perversely - as it currently is), would attract and retain the necessary private sector finance to boost activity, productivity and competitiveness.  The State is going to be tied into de facto ownership of the banking system for some time.  In the context of the "Great Deleveraging", succinctly described by Colm McCarthy, the State, consequently, needs to withdraw from ownership of infrastructure and utility activities and apply the proceeds to replenish the NPRF and to finance properly evaluated investments in sectors where the regulatory revenue model is difficult, or impossible, to apply.

As Andrew McDowell (the author of Fine Gael's Rebuilding Ireland policy document) has pointed out in another thread, politics and industrial relations present obstacles that have to be overcome, but the economic rationale should be crystal clear.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;A Keynesian story does better as an explanation - increases in aggregate demand fuelled by global growth, inward FDI, competiveness etc.&#8221;</p>
<p>As Brian Lucey has pointed out, in a post on another thread, the only Keynesian shot that this Government can find in its locker is that President Obama&#8217;s fiscal stimulus will work.  John&#8217;s post (above) provides the context.  Surely it&#8217;s time to craft our own Keynesian story to boost domestic demand while multipliers are in excess of unity and leakages are limited.</p>
<p>We have an appropriate independent regulatory model in key infrastructure and utlility sectors which, if applied properly (rather than perversely - as it currently is), would attract and retain the necessary private sector finance to boost activity, productivity and competitiveness.  The State is going to be tied into de facto ownership of the banking system for some time.  In the context of the &#8220;Great Deleveraging&#8221;, succinctly described by Colm McCarthy, the State, consequently, needs to withdraw from ownership of infrastructure and utility activities and apply the proceeds to replenish the NPRF and to finance properly evaluated investments in sectors where the regulatory revenue model is difficult, or impossible, to apply.</p>
<p>As Andrew McDowell (the author of Fine Gael&#8217;s Rebuilding Ireland policy document) has pointed out in another thread, politics and industrial relations present obstacles that have to be overcome, but the economic rationale should be crystal clear.</p>
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		<title>By: kevin denny</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-7004</link>
		<dc:creator>kevin denny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 May 2009 11:13:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-7004</guid>
		<description>If memory serves me right there was a SSISI paper back in the 80's on hysteresis in Irish unemployment by a Mr George Lee. I thought it was quite good at the time &#38; notwithstanding the rather critical comments he got.

W.r.t unemployment : preventing people entering long term unemployment is key. This depends on a combination of Passive Labour Market Policies (the operation of the benefit system largely) and Active LMP's. The soft target is replacement rates but its unclear that one gets much traction from lowering these &#38; remember there is huge variation in RR's so the average can be quite misleading. The duration of these (how long one is entitled to UB) matters. It also seems to matter how vigorously the system is applied: calling them in after 6 months &#38; checking that job search is going on etc.
And you need to combine all this with ALMP's, carrots as well as sticks.
A great deal was learned about unemployment in the 1980s and although the circumstances are not identical ( they never are) it would be worth revisiting this literature.
It seems to me that this would be a more useful step than the now rather tiresome debate about bank nationalisation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If memory serves me right there was a SSISI paper back in the 80&#8217;s on hysteresis in Irish unemployment by a Mr George Lee. I thought it was quite good at the time &amp; notwithstanding the rather critical comments he got.</p>
<p>W.r.t unemployment : preventing people entering long term unemployment is key. This depends on a combination of Passive Labour Market Policies (the operation of the benefit system largely) and Active LMP&#8217;s. The soft target is replacement rates but its unclear that one gets much traction from lowering these &amp; remember there is huge variation in RR&#8217;s so the average can be quite misleading. The duration of these (how long one is entitled to UB) matters. It also seems to matter how vigorously the system is applied: calling them in after 6 months &amp; checking that job search is going on etc.<br />
And you need to combine all this with ALMP&#8217;s, carrots as well as sticks.<br />
A great deal was learned about unemployment in the 1980s and although the circumstances are not identical ( they never are) it would be worth revisiting this literature.<br />
It seems to me that this would be a more useful step than the now rather tiresome debate about bank nationalisation.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Hennigan - Finfacts</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-6987</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Hennigan - Finfacts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 May 2009 04:18:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-6987</guid>
		<description>@John
It may not not be rocket science but the speed of recovery is unlikely to replicate what followed in other postwar recessions.

This recession will influence policy and business decisions for many years to come.

Governments are wallowing in red ink and for Ireland, what happens in the US and UK will have a big bearing.

Recent movements in the oil price signal that even with a tepid recovery, central bankers will begin to get jittery about inflation again. So borrowing costs will rise in coming years.

As for FDI, most of the recent projects have been investments from existing firms, while there has been a decline in Irish greenfield investments, coincident with rises in Eastern Europe.

Given the current anti-business sentiment in the US, there is also likely to be a reluctance for firms to move jobs overseas on a big scale, in the next few years.

Recently, student loans lender Sallie Mae announced that it would return 2,000 outsourced jobs from India and the Philippines. It was an attempt to influence Obama's plans on federal assisted loans. The Sallie Mae move didn't work, but it reflects the prevailing mood.

@Brendan
An interesting development during the boom, was the demand for people in their 40's and 50's who were viewed as more reliable compared with younger workers who changed jobs at a rapid rate.

The trend of older people losing jobs and being left on the scrapheap, will inevitably return.

The 2006 Census at the height of the boom, showed that Ballina, County Mayo had the highest unemployment rate among large Irish towns, with 15.8% of its labour force out of work. Tralee (14.2%) and Dundalk (13.9%) also had high unemployment at the time of the 2006 census while at the other end of the scale Malahide (4.3%) and Leixlip (4.4%) had the lowest rates.

The unemployment rate was calculated using the responses to the question on Principal Economic Status in the 2006 Census. The national rate was 8.5%, with urban areas (9.5%) having higher unemployment than rural areas (6.9%).

The official unemployment rate fell to 4.2% in late 2006.

With a population of 3 million, the jobless level was 65,000 in 1973. In 1977, in the aftermath of the dislocation of the quadrupling of oil prices in late 1973, FF leader Jack Lynch was able to say that a government with over 100,000 unemployed in the succeeding election, wouldn't deserve to be elected.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@John<br />
It may not not be rocket science but the speed of recovery is unlikely to replicate what followed in other postwar recessions.</p>
<p>This recession will influence policy and business decisions for many years to come.</p>
<p>Governments are wallowing in red ink and for Ireland, what happens in the US and UK will have a big bearing.</p>
<p>Recent movements in the oil price signal that even with a tepid recovery, central bankers will begin to get jittery about inflation again. So borrowing costs will rise in coming years.</p>
<p>As for FDI, most of the recent projects have been investments from existing firms, while there has been a decline in Irish greenfield investments, coincident with rises in Eastern Europe.</p>
<p>Given the current anti-business sentiment in the US, there is also likely to be a reluctance for firms to move jobs overseas on a big scale, in the next few years.</p>
<p>Recently, student loans lender Sallie Mae announced that it would return 2,000 outsourced jobs from India and the Philippines. It was an attempt to influence Obama&#8217;s plans on federal assisted loans. The Sallie Mae move didn&#8217;t work, but it reflects the prevailing mood.</p>
<p>@Brendan<br />
An interesting development during the boom, was the demand for people in their 40&#8217;s and 50&#8217;s who were viewed as more reliable compared with younger workers who changed jobs at a rapid rate.</p>
<p>The trend of older people losing jobs and being left on the scrapheap, will inevitably return.</p>
<p>The 2006 Census at the height of the boom, showed that Ballina, County Mayo had the highest unemployment rate among large Irish towns, with 15.8% of its labour force out of work. Tralee (14.2%) and Dundalk (13.9%) also had high unemployment at the time of the 2006 census while at the other end of the scale Malahide (4.3%) and Leixlip (4.4%) had the lowest rates.</p>
<p>The unemployment rate was calculated using the responses to the question on Principal Economic Status in the 2006 Census. The national rate was 8.5%, with urban areas (9.5%) having higher unemployment than rural areas (6.9%).</p>
<p>The official unemployment rate fell to 4.2% in late 2006.</p>
<p>With a population of 3 million, the jobless level was 65,000 in 1973. In 1977, in the aftermath of the dislocation of the quadrupling of oil prices in late 1973, FF leader Jack Lynch was able to say that a government with over 100,000 unemployed in the succeeding election, wouldn&#8217;t deserve to be elected.</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-6973</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 May 2009 21:17:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-6973</guid>
		<description>There are a number of major differences between the situation in Ireland today and that in the early to mid 1980s. In the early to mid 1980s, the employment rate in Ireland was by far the lowest in the EU15. Back then, only about 35% of the population aged 15+ in Ireland were in full-time equivalent employment. In 2007 Q4, on the eve of the global recession, the figure was approximately 55% and the full-time equivalent employment rate in Ireland was almost the highest in the EU15 and way above the EU15 average. These are the figures:

percentage of population aged 15+ in employment in 2007 Q4:

adjusted for percentage in part-time employment:

[ 1] Denmark         55.6%
[ 2] IRELAND         55.5% &#60;&#60;&#60;&#60;
[ 3] Portugal        54.3%
[ 4] Finland         52.4%
[ 5] Sweden          52.1%
[ 6] U. Kingdom      52.1%
[ 7] Austria         51.6%
[ 8] Spain           50.3%
[ 9] Neth’lands      49.1%
[10] Luxembourg      49.0%
[11] Germany         48.0%
[12] France          47.9%
[13] Greece          47.7%
[14] Belgium         44.7%
[15] Italy           42.8%

source: computed from figures in Eurostat online database

Even allowing for a large fall in employment in Ireland and smaller falls elsewhere in the EU15 in the course of the global recession, the full-time equivalent employment rate in Ireland is likely to remain above the EU average at the end of the global recession. One of the reasons why many EU countries have relatively low unemployment rates, despite having very low employment rates, is that, having had serious unemployment continuously since the 1970s, they have perfected techniques for keeping people out of the official unemployment figures. Chief among these are (a) allowing large numbers of persons to go on Invalidity Benefit rather than Unemployment Benefit (b) encouraging people to retire from the workforce while still relatively young, as shown by the following figures:

average exit age from labour force in 2006:

[ 1] IRELAND         64.1 &#60;&#60;&#60;&#60;
[ 2] Sweden          63.9
[ 3] U. Kingdom      63.2
[ 4] Portugal        63.1
[ 5] Finland         62.4
[ 6] Neth'lands      62.1
[ 7] Spain           62.0
[ 8] Denmark         61.9
[ 9] Germany         61.9
[10] Greece          61.1
[11] Austria         61.0
[12] Belgium         60.6
[13] Italy           60.2
[14] Luxembourg      59.4
[15] France          58.9

With regard to the economy, apart from the major difference of Ireland's GNP per capita (PPS) being 65% of the EU15 average in the early to mid 1980s and 115% of the EU15 average in 2007, the situation re the Balance-of-Payments is totally different today to what it was in the early to mid 1980s. At the beginning of the 1980s, there was not only a global recession but, in addition, a disastrous Balance-of-Payments deficit in Ireland which reached 13.7% of GDP in 1982. The result was that domestic demand, which is the main determinant of employment growth, had to be constrained in Ireland for years and years, despite good growth in the global economy and good growth in Irish exports from about 1983 on. That B-of-P deficit was more or less eliminated only around 1987/88. Once that happened, domestic demand was able to grow again and employment rose sharply and unemployment fell. Similarily, when the next global recession occurred in 1991/92, Ireland came out of it with only a very small Balance-ofPayments deficit. As a result, as soon as that global recession ended, domestic demand in Ireland was able to grow again and, as after 1987/88, employment rose sharply and unemployment fell. The actual Balance-of-Payments surplus/deficit figures are as follows:

1980     deficit of 10.9%                                      
1981     deficit of 13.7%                                      
1982     deficit of  9.9%                                       
1983     deficit of  6.7%                                      
1984     deficit of  6.0%                                      
1985     deficit of  4.5%                                      
1986     deficit of  3.4%                                     
1987     deficit of  0.4%                                     
1988     deficit of  0.3%                                      
1989     deficit of  1.9%                                      
1990     deficit of  1.8%                                      
1991     deficit of  0.4%                                      
1992     surplus of  0.4%                                     
1993     surplus of  3.7%                                     
1994     surplus of  2.9%                                       
1995     surplus of  2.8%                                    
1996     surplus of  3.3%                      
1997     surplus of  3.1%                               
1998     surplus of  0.8%                             
1999     surplus of  0.2%                              
2000     deficit of  0.4%                                   
2001     deficit of  0.6%                                 
2002     deficit of  1.0%                                   
2003     deficit of  0.0%                                   
2004     deficit of  0.6%                                     
2005     deficit of  3.5%                                 
2006     deficit of  3.6%                                   
2007     deficit of  5.4%                                     
2008     deficit of  4.5%              
2009     deficit of  0.0% (conservative forecast)

As the figures show, the B-of-P deficit is forecast to be virtually zero in 2009 (many economists actually forecast a large surplus in 2009). Hence, the situation today is more analogous to what pertained both in 1987/88 and later in 1991/92, rather than what pertained in 1981/82. Both in 1987/88 and 1991/92, because of the absence of any B-of-P constraint, domestic demand was able to grow in parallel to the growth in the world economy and, as a consequence, employment rose and in both periods unemployment fell sharply.

Given the absence of any Balance-of-Payments constraint today, the key requirement for getting unemployment down again is that, as soon as the current global recession ends, which there are increasing signs is going to happen later this year, domestic demand must be enabled to grow in parallel to the growth in the world economy, just as happened post 1987/88 and post 1991/92 (but which, for the reasons stated could not be allowed to happen post 1981/82). We should not be browbeaten into unnecessarily constraining domestic demand just for the purpose of achieving a large Balance-of-Payments surplus in the next few years. If domestic demand is allowed to grow in parallel to the growth in the world economy, as that world economy comes out of recession in the next few years, then the experience of the post 1987/88 and post 1991/92 periods indicate that Ireland's unemployment rate will fall sharply. Its not rocket science.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are a number of major differences between the situation in Ireland today and that in the early to mid 1980s. In the early to mid 1980s, the employment rate in Ireland was by far the lowest in the EU15. Back then, only about 35% of the population aged 15+ in Ireland were in full-time equivalent employment. In 2007 Q4, on the eve of the global recession, the figure was approximately 55% and the full-time equivalent employment rate in Ireland was almost the highest in the EU15 and way above the EU15 average. These are the figures:</p>
<p>percentage of population aged 15+ in employment in 2007 Q4:</p>
<p>adjusted for percentage in part-time employment:</p>
<p>[ 1] Denmark         55.6%<br />
[ 2] IRELAND         55.5% &lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;<br />
[ 3] Portugal        54.3%<br />
[ 4] Finland         52.4%<br />
[ 5] Sweden          52.1%<br />
[ 6] U. Kingdom      52.1%<br />
[ 7] Austria         51.6%<br />
[ 8] Spain           50.3%<br />
[ 9] Neth’lands      49.1%<br />
[10] Luxembourg      49.0%<br />
[11] Germany         48.0%<br />
[12] France          47.9%<br />
[13] Greece          47.7%<br />
[14] Belgium         44.7%<br />
[15] Italy           42.8%</p>
<p>source: computed from figures in Eurostat online database</p>
<p>Even allowing for a large fall in employment in Ireland and smaller falls elsewhere in the EU15 in the course of the global recession, the full-time equivalent employment rate in Ireland is likely to remain above the EU average at the end of the global recession. One of the reasons why many EU countries have relatively low unemployment rates, despite having very low employment rates, is that, having had serious unemployment continuously since the 1970s, they have perfected techniques for keeping people out of the official unemployment figures. Chief among these are (a) allowing large numbers of persons to go on Invalidity Benefit rather than Unemployment Benefit (b) encouraging people to retire from the workforce while still relatively young, as shown by the following figures:</p>
<p>average exit age from labour force in 2006:</p>
<p>[ 1] IRELAND         64.1 &lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;<br />
[ 2] Sweden          63.9<br />
[ 3] U. Kingdom      63.2<br />
[ 4] Portugal        63.1<br />
[ 5] Finland         62.4<br />
[ 6] Neth&#8217;lands      62.1<br />
[ 7] Spain           62.0<br />
[ 8] Denmark         61.9<br />
[ 9] Germany         61.9<br />
[10] Greece          61.1<br />
[11] Austria         61.0<br />
[12] Belgium         60.6<br />
[13] Italy           60.2<br />
[14] Luxembourg      59.4<br />
[15] France          58.9</p>
<p>With regard to the economy, apart from the major difference of Ireland&#8217;s GNP per capita (PPS) being 65% of the EU15 average in the early to mid 1980s and 115% of the EU15 average in 2007, the situation re the Balance-of-Payments is totally different today to what it was in the early to mid 1980s. At the beginning of the 1980s, there was not only a global recession but, in addition, a disastrous Balance-of-Payments deficit in Ireland which reached 13.7% of GDP in 1982. The result was that domestic demand, which is the main determinant of employment growth, had to be constrained in Ireland for years and years, despite good growth in the global economy and good growth in Irish exports from about 1983 on. That B-of-P deficit was more or less eliminated only around 1987/88. Once that happened, domestic demand was able to grow again and employment rose sharply and unemployment fell. Similarily, when the next global recession occurred in 1991/92, Ireland came out of it with only a very small Balance-ofPayments deficit. As a result, as soon as that global recession ended, domestic demand in Ireland was able to grow again and, as after 1987/88, employment rose sharply and unemployment fell. The actual Balance-of-Payments surplus/deficit figures are as follows:</p>
<p>1980     deficit of 10.9%<br />
1981     deficit of 13.7%<br />
1982     deficit of  9.9%<br />
1983     deficit of  6.7%<br />
1984     deficit of  6.0%<br />
1985     deficit of  4.5%<br />
1986     deficit of  3.4%<br />
1987     deficit of  0.4%<br />
1988     deficit of  0.3%<br />
1989     deficit of  1.9%<br />
1990     deficit of  1.8%<br />
1991     deficit of  0.4%<br />
1992     surplus of  0.4%<br />
1993     surplus of  3.7%<br />
1994     surplus of  2.9%<br />
1995     surplus of  2.8%<br />
1996     surplus of  3.3%<br />
1997     surplus of  3.1%<br />
1998     surplus of  0.8%<br />
1999     surplus of  0.2%<br />
2000     deficit of  0.4%<br />
2001     deficit of  0.6%<br />
2002     deficit of  1.0%<br />
2003     deficit of  0.0%<br />
2004     deficit of  0.6%<br />
2005     deficit of  3.5%<br />
2006     deficit of  3.6%<br />
2007     deficit of  5.4%<br />
2008     deficit of  4.5%<br />
2009     deficit of  0.0% (conservative forecast)</p>
<p>As the figures show, the B-of-P deficit is forecast to be virtually zero in 2009 (many economists actually forecast a large surplus in 2009). Hence, the situation today is more analogous to what pertained both in 1987/88 and later in 1991/92, rather than what pertained in 1981/82. Both in 1987/88 and 1991/92, because of the absence of any B-of-P constraint, domestic demand was able to grow in parallel to the growth in the world economy and, as a consequence, employment rose and in both periods unemployment fell sharply.</p>
<p>Given the absence of any Balance-of-Payments constraint today, the key requirement for getting unemployment down again is that, as soon as the current global recession ends, which there are increasing signs is going to happen later this year, domestic demand must be enabled to grow in parallel to the growth in the world economy, just as happened post 1987/88 and post 1991/92 (but which, for the reasons stated could not be allowed to happen post 1981/82). We should not be browbeaten into unnecessarily constraining domestic demand just for the purpose of achieving a large Balance-of-Payments surplus in the next few years. If domestic demand is allowed to grow in parallel to the growth in the world economy, as that world economy comes out of recession in the next few years, then the experience of the post 1987/88 and post 1991/92 periods indicate that Ireland&#8217;s unemployment rate will fall sharply. Its not rocket science.</p>
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		<title>By: John McHale</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-6967</link>
		<dc:creator>John McHale</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 May 2009 19:30:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-6967</guid>
		<description>Brendan, you do us all a service in pointing out the likely long-lasting effects on unemployment of this recession.   As I’m sure you are painfully aware from your own work with these data, it is difficult to estimate reliable models of equilibrium unemployment from the cross-national data.  For my money, the most convincing attempt is the work of Olivier Blanchard and Justin Wolfers in the Economic Journal (JSTOR and NBER WP links below).  The central idea is that macroeconomic shocks interact with labour market policies/institutions to produce potentially long-lasting impacts on unemployment.   I think this is consistent with your review of the Irish case.  The timely policy lesson is that it is important to minimise both the initial adverse shock and to promote flexible labour market policies.  

Published version: http://www.jstor.org/stable/pdfplus/2565720.pdf

NBER Working Paper version: http://www.nber.org/papers/w7282</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brendan, you do us all a service in pointing out the likely long-lasting effects on unemployment of this recession.   As I’m sure you are painfully aware from your own work with these data, it is difficult to estimate reliable models of equilibrium unemployment from the cross-national data.  For my money, the most convincing attempt is the work of Olivier Blanchard and Justin Wolfers in the Economic Journal (JSTOR and NBER WP links below).  The central idea is that macroeconomic shocks interact with labour market policies/institutions to produce potentially long-lasting impacts on unemployment.   I think this is consistent with your review of the Irish case.  The timely policy lesson is that it is important to minimise both the initial adverse shock and to promote flexible labour market policies.  </p>
<p>Published version: <a href="http://www.jstor.org/stable/pdfplus/2565720.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.jstor.org/stable/pdfplus/2565720.pdf</a></p>
<p>NBER Working Paper version: <a href="http://www.nber.org/papers/w7282" rel="nofollow">http://www.nber.org/papers/w7282</a></p>
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		<title>By: Ronan L</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2009/05/08/rembrance-of-things-past/#comment-6960</link>
		<dc:creator>Ronan L</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 May 2009 17:47:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=2065#comment-6960</guid>
		<description>Interesting - speaking of the Great War, as part of my thesis, I had to come up with some ballpark estimates of unemployment in the 1920s and 1930s for Ireland among other countries... will check back on that and see what Kevin and I concluded.

One other comment - would the Washington Consensus crowd be happy with your description of Ireland's harnessing of global growth and FDI as a Keynesian story? Perhaps it's been the atmosphere here these last 15 years or so, but that strikes me as an interesting description of events. Or perhaps this is just a neutral reference to the AD = C + I + G + NX model?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting - speaking of the Great War, as part of my thesis, I had to come up with some ballpark estimates of unemployment in the 1920s and 1930s for Ireland among other countries&#8230; will check back on that and see what Kevin and I concluded.</p>
<p>One other comment - would the Washington Consensus crowd be happy with your description of Ireland&#8217;s harnessing of global growth and FDI as a Keynesian story? Perhaps it&#8217;s been the atmosphere here these last 15 years or so, but that strikes me as an interesting description of events. Or perhaps this is just a neutral reference to the AD = C + I + G + NX model?</p>
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