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	<title>Comments on: Why renminbi appreciation is in China&#8217;s interests</title>
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	<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/01/14/why-renminbi-appreciation-is-in-chinas-interests/</link>
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	<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 07:24:45 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Pat Donnelly</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/01/14/why-renminbi-appreciation-is-in-chinas-interests/#comment-32261</link>
		<dc:creator>Pat Donnelly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Jan 2010 17:16:57 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Am I right in thinking that US/UK/Dutch banks have not made much inroad into China?

The Chinese are full of capital in the sense that they are discovering all the inefficiency of peasant economy and dismantling it wholesale and across the second largest population in the world? The labour freed up enables resources to be internally harvested and the only capital brought in is in the form of design etc for the new mainly manufacturing industries. 

How long can this go on? Well it seems that it is like a weighted treadmill: it must go on or else the whole thing will collapse. There are many millions of peasants still on the land. All the new capital created is not actually monetized in full, particularly it is also hidden in their large savings ratio, locking away much value. Perhaps therefore, the government can succesfully spend ie invent monetary capital to make up the difference?

The only problem would be for the money to be misdirected as they lack mature independent markets which used to perform that function in the west? They can substitute internal consumption for exports, but it will require a new model, which is necessary given the lack of these markets. Any collapse in western demand, which is unlikely as they can and will out compete, will trigger the development of these markets? The encouragement of gold ptm etc purchases, is effectively to quell internal speculations on land and stock exchanges, but not to kill them. They are becoming much wealthier and losing none of it to the banking system. The exports are merely invested in foreign paper and now commodity investments. The whole set up lacks the connections engineered by a banking system. Their central control acts as such a system, bypassing the banking system?

Now were I Indian, I might be very interested in studying that whole process.

Thus they can set virtually any value they wish on the RMB? It just requires more activity on their part and soacial but mainly structural adjustment enabling them to exercise more control. 

Ultimately they will revalue and quite a bit up, as they do not face Japan style problems of a bubble and declining population and overstrong currency. As they will have few competitors at that stage, it will take some time to overcome the barriers to entry in the west, particularly if we have destroyed most of our remaining capital in another sovereign bubble?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Am I right in thinking that US/UK/Dutch banks have not made much inroad into China?</p>
<p>The Chinese are full of capital in the sense that they are discovering all the inefficiency of peasant economy and dismantling it wholesale and across the second largest population in the world? The labour freed up enables resources to be internally harvested and the only capital brought in is in the form of design etc for the new mainly manufacturing industries. </p>
<p>How long can this go on? Well it seems that it is like a weighted treadmill: it must go on or else the whole thing will collapse. There are many millions of peasants still on the land. All the new capital created is not actually monetized in full, particularly it is also hidden in their large savings ratio, locking away much value. Perhaps therefore, the government can succesfully spend ie invent monetary capital to make up the difference?</p>
<p>The only problem would be for the money to be misdirected as they lack mature independent markets which used to perform that function in the west? They can substitute internal consumption for exports, but it will require a new model, which is necessary given the lack of these markets. Any collapse in western demand, which is unlikely as they can and will out compete, will trigger the development of these markets? The encouragement of gold ptm etc purchases, is effectively to quell internal speculations on land and stock exchanges, but not to kill them. They are becoming much wealthier and losing none of it to the banking system. The exports are merely invested in foreign paper and now commodity investments. The whole set up lacks the connections engineered by a banking system. Their central control acts as such a system, bypassing the banking system?</p>
<p>Now were I Indian, I might be very interested in studying that whole process.</p>
<p>Thus they can set virtually any value they wish on the RMB? It just requires more activity on their part and soacial but mainly structural adjustment enabling them to exercise more control. </p>
<p>Ultimately they will revalue and quite a bit up, as they do not face Japan style problems of a bubble and declining population and overstrong currency. As they will have few competitors at that stage, it will take some time to overcome the barriers to entry in the west, particularly if we have destroyed most of our remaining capital in another sovereign bubble?</p>
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		<title>By: zhou_enlai</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/01/14/why-renminbi-appreciation-is-in-chinas-interests/#comment-32175</link>
		<dc:creator>zhou_enlai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jan 2010 13:33:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=5273#comment-32175</guid>
		<description>A relevant podcast from the LSE:

China in the Global Economic Crisis
Speaker: Professor Danny Quah
5 November 2009

http://www.lse.ac.uk/resources/podcasts/publicLecturesAndEvents.htm

Danny Quah takes a contrarian view that China is on the right path in its economic and monetary policies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A relevant podcast from the LSE:</p>
<p>China in the Global Economic Crisis<br />
Speaker: Professor Danny Quah<br />
5 November 2009</p>
<p><a href="http://www.lse.ac.uk/resources/podcasts/publicLecturesAndEvents.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.lse.ac.uk/resources/podcasts/publicLecturesAndEvents.htm</a></p>
<p>Danny Quah takes a contrarian view that China is on the right path in its economic and monetary policies.</p>
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		<title>By: Pat Donnelly</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/01/14/why-renminbi-appreciation-is-in-chinas-interests/#comment-32115</link>
		<dc:creator>Pat Donnelly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jan 2010 07:02:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=5273#comment-32115</guid>
		<description>Given that the Han dominate all others in China, stabilty is a must. Google's move to leave and to escape that control, taking their chances with the chinese market being blocked off to them, is a good reason why they were right to be so respectful of the wishes of the Han to have stability. They have some leverage. So has the US. 

But the US has bleated again and again about import controls. They will not impose a general control because much of what had been US manufacturing is now located in China. It is designed to flow into the USA. Can we imagine the hullabuloo if the depreciated the Yuan vs the $? What industries are left in the USA that can benefit from protection? As the US economy contracts, despite all the msm talk about green shoots and recovery, what industry will be left? Aerospace, arms, farming Ford and forestry. 

What the US can afford to buy from China is declining and so are the trade flows. China has not devalued the Yuan and may not do so. It will continue to do what is successful, as a kind of hypnotic trance paralyzes policy formation in all countries in a boom. No one wants to be a party pooper!

The US will continue to amass campaign funds by shouting out about tartiffs. China will continue payoffs to ensure business as usual. If the USA tries to scapegoat the Han, I look forward to some chinese chess, also known as Go. Surprizes for the USA, and not of the pleasant kind, but not in any way tracable to the Han. The USA is now in Pakistan, an ally of China of long standing. This is felt as a threat by China. Buttressing Terror helps the USA, revealing it to be a charade will hurt no one, will it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Given that the Han dominate all others in China, stabilty is a must. Google&#8217;s move to leave and to escape that control, taking their chances with the chinese market being blocked off to them, is a good reason why they were right to be so respectful of the wishes of the Han to have stability. They have some leverage. So has the US. </p>
<p>But the US has bleated again and again about import controls. They will not impose a general control because much of what had been US manufacturing is now located in China. It is designed to flow into the USA. Can we imagine the hullabuloo if the depreciated the Yuan vs the $? What industries are left in the USA that can benefit from protection? As the US economy contracts, despite all the msm talk about green shoots and recovery, what industry will be left? Aerospace, arms, farming Ford and forestry. </p>
<p>What the US can afford to buy from China is declining and so are the trade flows. China has not devalued the Yuan and may not do so. It will continue to do what is successful, as a kind of hypnotic trance paralyzes policy formation in all countries in a boom. No one wants to be a party pooper!</p>
<p>The US will continue to amass campaign funds by shouting out about tartiffs. China will continue payoffs to ensure business as usual. If the USA tries to scapegoat the Han, I look forward to some chinese chess, also known as Go. Surprizes for the USA, and not of the pleasant kind, but not in any way tracable to the Han. The USA is now in Pakistan, an ally of China of long standing. This is felt as a threat by China. Buttressing Terror helps the USA, revealing it to be a charade will hurt no one, will it?</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Burke</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/01/14/why-renminbi-appreciation-is-in-chinas-interests/#comment-32067</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Burke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 19:44:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=5273#comment-32067</guid>
		<description>Given the performance of the Chinese economy, policymakers there might have a good idea of what's in their interests.

But RMB appreciation might not be much help to the US. 

 http://ablog.typepad.com/key_trends_in_the_world_e/2009/11/chinas-trade-and-chinas-exchange-rate.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Given the performance of the Chinese economy, policymakers there might have a good idea of what&#8217;s in their interests.</p>
<p>But RMB appreciation might not be much help to the US. </p>
<p> <a href="http://ablog.typepad.com/key_trends_in_the_world_e/2009/11/chinas-trade-and-chinas-exchange-rate.html" rel="nofollow">http://ablog.typepad.com/key_trends_in_the_world_e/2009/11/chinas-trade-and-chinas-exchange-rate.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Geckko</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/01/14/why-renminbi-appreciation-is-in-chinas-interests/#comment-32047</link>
		<dc:creator>Geckko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 17:04:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=5273#comment-32047</guid>
		<description>Can't disagree. I have written about this myself.

But one symptom and important socio political factor that isn't mentioned int he article is the ballooning capital account that comes necessarily with the ballooning current account.

There are undoubtedly many influential decision makers in China that are enjoying spending the foreign currency that is washing into the country like a tsunami. There is much political and nationalistic utility to be dervied from spending this by buying up a large assortment of foreign assets.

A quick Google will show the current extent of the Chinese spending spree. Such globetrotting fun will be hard to give up for the ruling elite.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Can&#8217;t disagree. I have written about this myself.</p>
<p>But one symptom and important socio political factor that isn&#8217;t mentioned int he article is the ballooning capital account that comes necessarily with the ballooning current account.</p>
<p>There are undoubtedly many influential decision makers in China that are enjoying spending the foreign currency that is washing into the country like a tsunami. There is much political and nationalistic utility to be dervied from spending this by buying up a large assortment of foreign assets.</p>
<p>A quick Google will show the current extent of the Chinese spending spree. Such globetrotting fun will be hard to give up for the ruling elite.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Hennigan - Finfacts</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/01/14/why-renminbi-appreciation-is-in-chinas-interests/#comment-32016</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Hennigan - Finfacts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 13:47:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=5273#comment-32016</guid>
		<description>The Chinese have already taken measures this week on the monetary side and while they may end the unofficial peg against the US dollar, which has been in force some 2008, on past form, a small appreciation will be tolerated.

Don't be surprised if by 2011, a slow recovery in the US and losses in the mid-term elections, will force Obama to play the Nixon card and impose a special tariff on Chinese imports.

In 1971, Nixon had forced a realignment of currencies through the ending of the fixed rates regime by imposing a unilateral special tariff.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Chinese have already taken measures this week on the monetary side and while they may end the unofficial peg against the US dollar, which has been in force some 2008, on past form, a small appreciation will be tolerated.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t be surprised if by 2011, a slow recovery in the US and losses in the mid-term elections, will force Obama to play the Nixon card and impose a special tariff on Chinese imports.</p>
<p>In 1971, Nixon had forced a realignment of currencies through the ending of the fixed rates regime by imposing a unilateral special tariff.</p>
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		<title>By: Ciaran Daly</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/01/14/why-renminbi-appreciation-is-in-chinas-interests/#comment-31993</link>
		<dc:creator>Ciaran Daly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 11:59:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=5273#comment-31993</guid>
		<description>If the Chinese are still determined to manipulate their currency, then what to do?  I think US protectionism / trade war  would be the only way to make them see sense, the US is still much more powerful in this regard surely.  Martin Wolf has mentioned this problem too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the Chinese are still determined to manipulate their currency, then what to do?  I think US protectionism / trade war  would be the only way to make them see sense, the US is still much more powerful in this regard surely.  Martin Wolf has mentioned this problem too.</p>
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		<title>By: MarcusOC</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/01/14/why-renminbi-appreciation-is-in-chinas-interests/#comment-31971</link>
		<dc:creator>MarcusOC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 09:45:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/?p=5273#comment-31971</guid>
		<description>Seems a sound argument. I find this a lot more convincing than Paul Krugman's recent blogging on this topic (&lt;a href="http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/12/31/macroeconomic-effects-of-chinese-mercantilism/" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/A&gt; and &lt;a href="http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/12/28/renminbi-rx/" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/A&gt;).

Would another good reason (from a Chinese perspective) for the Chinese to change their policy be the possibility that their current policy will force dollar-printing, which would destroy their reserves?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seems a sound argument. I find this a lot more convincing than Paul Krugman&#8217;s recent blogging on this topic (<a href="http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/12/31/macroeconomic-effects-of-chinese-mercantilism/" rel="nofollow">here</a> and <a href="http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/12/28/renminbi-rx/" rel="nofollow">here</a>).</p>
<p>Would another good reason (from a Chinese perspective) for the Chinese to change their policy be the possibility that their current policy will force dollar-printing, which would destroy their reserves?</p>
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