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	<title>Comments on: Banking Crisis, Bondholders and the Single Currency Project</title>
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	<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/</link>
	<description></description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 04:30:22 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Frank Barry</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-104369</link>
		<dc:creator>Frank Barry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Dec 2010 11:19:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-104369</guid>
		<description>@ P.L. Malone:
One example, among numerous others, comes from F. Barry (2001) "Fiscal Policy in EMU", in E. Pentecost and A. van Poeck (eds.) European Monetary Integration, Aldershot: Edward Elgar:

For a severe recession that caused a 10 percent decline in the incomes of one-half of the EU, transfers to depressed regions on a scale equivalent to that available in the US would amount to 0.5% of EU GDP.  This would entail a massive 50% increase in total spending on EU programmes; Eichengreen (1990). Could monetary union survive if such aid were not forthcoming from a federal EU budget?  While political scientists warn that the political fabric does not exist to deliver a significantly larger EU budget, and that “subsidiarity” in any case militates against the transfer of welfare state functions to Brussels, Costa and De Grauwe (1999) have warned recently that the “failure (to create a European government with similar responsibilities to present national ones) creates the risk of the break-up of the monetary union”.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ P.L. Malone:<br />
One example, among numerous others, comes from F. Barry (2001) &#8220;Fiscal Policy in EMU&#8221;, in E. Pentecost and A. van Poeck (eds.) European Monetary Integration, Aldershot: Edward Elgar:</p>
<p>For a severe recession that caused a 10 percent decline in the incomes of one-half of the EU, transfers to depressed regions on a scale equivalent to that available in the US would amount to 0.5% of EU GDP.  This would entail a massive 50% increase in total spending on EU programmes; Eichengreen (1990). Could monetary union survive if such aid were not forthcoming from a federal EU budget?  While political scientists warn that the political fabric does not exist to deliver a significantly larger EU budget, and that “subsidiarity” in any case militates against the transfer of welfare state functions to Brussels, Costa and De Grauwe (1999) have warned recently that the “failure (to create a European government with similar responsibilities to present national ones) creates the risk of the break-up of the monetary union”.</p>
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		<title>By: P L Malone</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-103417</link>
		<dc:creator>P L Malone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Dec 2010 09:26:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-103417</guid>
		<description>Funny how history gets rewritten so quickly.
There's hardly an economist standing that doesn't claim to have foreseen the crisis and diagnosed the weaknesses of the Euro / EMU project.  But sometimes the evidence doesn't support these claims to prophetic insight.
An issue of the Journal of Common Market Studies (Dec 2003) devoted to the impact of EMU on growth and convergence was pretty upbeat.  Here's a summery of Frank Barry's contribution: 
"A critical question, then, is whether this general strong convergence at the national level will continue into the future under the EMU regime. In his
article in this volume, Barry ascribes the return to convergence to improved micro- and macroeconomic policy-making at the national level, partly in response to EU initiatives associated with the advent of EMU." The article by Barry is silent about the issues on which he comments here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Funny how history gets rewritten so quickly.<br />
There&#8217;s hardly an economist standing that doesn&#8217;t claim to have foreseen the crisis and diagnosed the weaknesses of the Euro / EMU project.  But sometimes the evidence doesn&#8217;t support these claims to prophetic insight.<br />
An issue of the Journal of Common Market Studies (Dec 2003) devoted to the impact of EMU on growth and convergence was pretty upbeat.  Here&#8217;s a summery of Frank Barry&#8217;s contribution:<br />
&#8220;A critical question, then, is whether this general strong convergence at the national level will continue into the future under the EMU regime. In his<br />
article in this volume, Barry ascribes the return to convergence to improved micro- and macroeconomic policy-making at the national level, partly in response to EU initiatives associated with the advent of EMU.&#8221; The article by Barry is silent about the issues on which he comments here.</p>
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		<title>By: Zerohedge - &#34;Portugal 1 week away from bailout&#34; - Page 5</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-101501</link>
		<dc:creator>Zerohedge - &#34;Portugal 1 week away from bailout&#34; - Page 5</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Dec 2010 01:43:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-101501</guid>
		<description>[...] of a disorderly disintegration of the eurozone would be disasterious for the Global economy. The Irish Economy </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] of a disorderly disintegration of the eurozone would be disasterious for the Global economy. The Irish Economy</p>
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		<title>By: hoganmahew</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100531</link>
		<dc:creator>hoganmahew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 2010 10:02:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100531</guid>
		<description>@Robert Browne
This is a disaster. What does he think he's doing?! Has he taken professional advice on this? Has the derivatives book been valued externally?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Robert Browne<br />
This is a disaster. What does he think he&#8217;s doing?! Has he taken professional advice on this? Has the derivatives book been valued externally?</p>
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		<title>By: Edward Moran</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100498</link>
		<dc:creator>Edward Moran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 2010 08:38:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100498</guid>
		<description>Well said.

Media blaming the markets is like blaming a wolf-pack for following its instincts.

Does no one remember the market frenzy of 1966-1973 when market-driven panic drove world currencies wild.

A new era of penal laws looms - albeit economic rather than political but all the more destructive and enslaving for that very reason. 

We can and must focus on solutions to our enslavement, not just banks' debt which has been treason has foisted upon us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well said.</p>
<p>Media blaming the markets is like blaming a wolf-pack for following its instincts.</p>
<p>Does no one remember the market frenzy of 1966-1973 when market-driven panic drove world currencies wild.</p>
<p>A new era of penal laws looms - albeit economic rather than political but all the more destructive and enslaving for that very reason. </p>
<p>We can and must focus on solutions to our enslavement, not just banks&#8217; debt which has been treason has foisted upon us.</p>
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		<title>By: Hugh Sheehy</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100496</link>
		<dc:creator>Hugh Sheehy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 2010 08:37:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100496</guid>
		<description>@a punter
For the record, I do not want blood.  Certainly not in the streets of Dublin.  

That's not something to joke about and certainly not something to sing about.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@a punter<br />
For the record, I do not want blood.  Certainly not in the streets of Dublin.  </p>
<p>That&#8217;s not something to joke about and certainly not something to sing about.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Browne</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100426</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Browne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 2010 03:39:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100426</guid>
		<description>Remember, there are still 27 encrypted computers down at Anglo and nobody has figured out that what is needed is 27 cells.

Lenihan guarantees Anglo derivatives, again!
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2010/1129/1224284371238.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Remember, there are still 27 encrypted computers down at Anglo and nobody has figured out that what is needed is 27 cells.</p>
<p>Lenihan guarantees Anglo derivatives, again!<br />
<a href="http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2010/1129/1224284371238.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2010/1129/1224284371238.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: a punter</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100350</link>
		<dc:creator>a punter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 23:23:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100350</guid>
		<description>We want Blood: Best crisis protest song so far
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndzKAaZ3prs&#38;feature=player_embedded#!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We want Blood: Best crisis protest song so far<br />
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndzKAaZ3prs&amp;feature=player_embedded#" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndzKAaZ3prs&amp;feature=player_embedded#</a>!</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100259</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 21:27:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100259</guid>
		<description>@Oliver Vandt - "That has been a repeated pattern in the banking catastrophe"

Having had some experience in the financial services 'communications' area myself, I can confirm that's a pretty normal approach. The golden rule there is only ever drip feed bad news. Drip, drip, drip. Oops, I appear to have a big puddle here now.

Pat Rabbit is no idiot. If I get the chance I will ask him about this but it might not be this side of Christmas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Oliver Vandt - &#8220;That has been a repeated pattern in the banking catastrophe&#8221;</p>
<p>Having had some experience in the financial services &#8216;communications&#8217; area myself, I can confirm that&#8217;s a pretty normal approach. The golden rule there is only ever drip feed bad news. Drip, drip, drip. Oops, I appear to have a big puddle here now.</p>
<p>Pat Rabbit is no idiot. If I get the chance I will ask him about this but it might not be this side of Christmas.</p>
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		<title>By: longhand</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100209</link>
		<dc:creator>longhand</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 20:48:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100209</guid>
		<description>Englishman EMP "dresses down" EU President on destruction of democracy re.Irish 4yr plan - strongspeech
http://www.realecontv.com/page/744.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Englishman EMP &#8220;dresses down&#8221; EU President on destruction of democracy re.Irish 4yr plan - strongspeech<br />
<a href="http://www.realecontv.com/page/744.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.realecontv.com/page/744.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: longhand</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100206</link>
		<dc:creator>longhand</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 20:45:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100206</guid>
		<description>Englishman EMP "dresses down" EU President on destruction of democracy - strongspeech
http://www.realecontv.com/page/744.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Englishman EMP &#8220;dresses down&#8221; EU President on destruction of democracy - strongspeech<br />
<a href="http://www.realecontv.com/page/744.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.realecontv.com/page/744.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: ceteris paribus</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100116</link>
		<dc:creator>ceteris paribus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 19:13:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100116</guid>
		<description>10billion immediate capitalization of banks.
Anyone hazard a guess as to the breakdown.
press conference very short on detail</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>10billion immediate capitalization of banks.<br />
Anyone hazard a guess as to the breakdown.<br />
press conference very short on detail</p>
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		<title>By: ceteris paribus</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100106</link>
		<dc:creator>ceteris paribus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 18:53:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100106</guid>
		<description>no support (political) to torch seniors according to BC.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>no support (political) to torch seniors according to BC.</p>
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		<title>By: ceteris paribus</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100103</link>
		<dc:creator>ceteris paribus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 18:48:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100103</guid>
		<description>no senior bondholders torched.
subs to be extended to other banks?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>no senior bondholders torched.<br />
subs to be extended to other banks?</p>
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		<title>By: alan c</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100102</link>
		<dc:creator>alan c</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 18:47:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100102</guid>
		<description>sounds like burning the bondholders was discussed but the govt blinked first.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sounds like burning the bondholders was discussed but the govt blinked first.</p>
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		<title>By: ceteris paribus</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100098</link>
		<dc:creator>ceteris paribus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 18:44:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100098</guid>
		<description>that 5.8% rate is variable - it can go up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>that 5.8% rate is variable - it can go up.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian Woods II</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100085</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian Woods II</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 18:25:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100085</guid>
		<description>5.8% per annum

20 mins into RTE nees and a passing reference to the dervitaves nuke. RTE plays it down as nuffin' new.  Was our furry little rabit duped?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>5.8% per annum</p>
<p>20 mins into RTE nees and a passing reference to the dervitaves nuke. RTE plays it down as nuffin&#8217; new.  Was our furry little rabit duped?</p>
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		<title>By: seafóid</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100075</link>
		<dc:creator>seafóid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:58:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100075</guid>
		<description>Oh, the irony of placating German voters with an interest rate that would have done the Treaty of Versailles justice. It was the Treaty of Versailles with its reparations which led to the inflation which brought down the Weimar republic and lead to the rise of the Nazis and the eventual Vertreibung which is such a part of the mental landscape of every modern German, for whom inflation is the ultimate bogeyman.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, the irony of placating German voters with an interest rate that would have done the Treaty of Versailles justice. It was the Treaty of Versailles with its reparations which led to the inflation which brought down the Weimar republic and lead to the rise of the Nazis and the eventual Vertreibung which is such a part of the mental landscape of every modern German, for whom inflation is the ultimate bogeyman.</p>
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		<title>By: grumpy</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100067</link>
		<dc:creator>grumpy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:39:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100067</guid>
		<description>Peston is reporting no haircuts for senior bonds and Germany holding out for 7% interest rate to placate German voters.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Peston is reporting no haircuts for senior bonds and Germany holding out for 7% interest rate to placate German voters.</p>
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		<title>By: Oliver Vandt</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100061</link>
		<dc:creator>Oliver Vandt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:27:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100061</guid>
		<description>If I was a government spinner trying to reveal significant derivative losses I would:
- privately leak that there were gigantic derivative losses
then when it was alleged in the media through my leaking or anyone else leaking I would
- then slag everyone off for scaremongering
- as I publicly revealed that the losses were in fact "only" a couple of billion and completely manageable
- of course later it might be found that they were a few more billion...and a few more billion after that etc

That has been a repeated pattern in the banking catastrophe. 
Claim made of big losses.
Government angrily denies then reveals "small" losses
These losses then grow and grow and grow.

Rabbitte once said he knew of a file that would rock the state regarding government collusion with the catholic church, during the 1994 Brendan Smyth extradition that brought down the government. He was widely mocked when
it didn't turn up. But with the publication of reports of the abuse tribunals we can see that that the collusion he alleged was going on to a massively greater extent than anyone would have believed. The wiki on Albert Reynolds alledges that a CH4 documentary revealed the affair - I can't remember- embarassing an Irish media who were silent, due to libel laws. Nothing changes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If I was a government spinner trying to reveal significant derivative losses I would:<br />
- privately leak that there were gigantic derivative losses<br />
then when it was alleged in the media through my leaking or anyone else leaking I would<br />
- then slag everyone off for scaremongering<br />
- as I publicly revealed that the losses were in fact &#8220;only&#8221; a couple of billion and completely manageable<br />
- of course later it might be found that they were a few more billion&#8230;and a few more billion after that etc</p>
<p>That has been a repeated pattern in the banking catastrophe.<br />
Claim made of big losses.<br />
Government angrily denies then reveals &#8220;small&#8221; losses<br />
These losses then grow and grow and grow.</p>
<p>Rabbitte once said he knew of a file that would rock the state regarding government collusion with the catholic church, during the 1994 Brendan Smyth extradition that brought down the government. He was widely mocked when<br />
it didn&#8217;t turn up. But with the publication of reports of the abuse tribunals we can see that that the collusion he alleged was going on to a massively greater extent than anyone would have believed. The wiki on Albert Reynolds alledges that a CH4 documentary revealed the affair - I can&#8217;t remember- embarassing an Irish media who were silent, due to libel laws. Nothing changes.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Hennigan - Finfacts</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100055</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Hennigan - Finfacts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:10:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100055</guid>
		<description>@ hoganmahew 

Morgan Stanley says in the US, there were three main factors in debtflation in the post-war period. First, outlays such as social security were not closely linked to inflation. Second, bondholders were surprised by inflation both after the war and in the 1970s. Third, in the first post-War decade, the average maturity of the debt was - at more than 100 months - exceptionally high.

The largest contribution of inflation to debt reduction came in the decade immediately after World War 2 (1946-1955). Despite a primary surplus of 1.2% of GDP, overall the budget was in deficit by 0.3% of GDP on average. Yet, the debt was reduced by 4.9% of GDP a year, through a nominal growth effect of 5.2% annually, as nominal GDP growth averaged 6.5% over the period. This very large nominal growth effect is mainly due to a substantial inflation effect - inflation averaged 4.2% over the period - which reduced debt to GDP by 3.7% every year, and to a much lesser extent to real GDP growth, which on average contributed 1.5% of GDP to debt reduction.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ hoganmahew </p>
<p>Morgan Stanley says in the US, there were three main factors in debtflation in the post-war period. First, outlays such as social security were not closely linked to inflation. Second, bondholders were surprised by inflation both after the war and in the 1970s. Third, in the first post-War decade, the average maturity of the debt was - at more than 100 months - exceptionally high.</p>
<p>The largest contribution of inflation to debt reduction came in the decade immediately after World War 2 (1946-1955). Despite a primary surplus of 1.2% of GDP, overall the budget was in deficit by 0.3% of GDP on average. Yet, the debt was reduced by 4.9% of GDP a year, through a nominal growth effect of 5.2% annually, as nominal GDP growth averaged 6.5% over the period. This very large nominal growth effect is mainly due to a substantial inflation effect - inflation averaged 4.2% over the period - which reduced debt to GDP by 3.7% every year, and to a much lesser extent to real GDP growth, which on average contributed 1.5% of GDP to debt reduction.</p>
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		<title>By: Neil P McCann</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100048</link>
		<dc:creator>Neil P McCann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 16:48:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100048</guid>
		<description>It is astonishing about this report re the NPRF is that it has not been denied and does not appear on RTE website as news.  Is there another media blackout for some reason connected to the Ecofin meeting in Brussels this afternoon? hey certainly don't want the approval and announcement of our loan deal derailed.  They have their eyes on tomorrows markets in Spanish, Portuguese and Belgian bonds? What is going on?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is astonishing about this report re the NPRF is that it has not been denied and does not appear on RTE website as news.  Is there another media blackout for some reason connected to the Ecofin meeting in Brussels this afternoon? hey certainly don&#8217;t want the approval and announcement of our loan deal derailed.  They have their eyes on tomorrows markets in Spanish, Portuguese and Belgian bonds? What is going on?</p>
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		<title>By: EWI</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100046</link>
		<dc:creator>EWI</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 16:47:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100046</guid>
		<description>@ Joseph

&lt;i&gt;Over the medium to long term sure but not in the first couple of years when wages are trying to catch up frog-hops in inflation. It would cause cashflow problems as you get 2-3 mortgage hikes before a wage rise kicks in.&lt;/i&gt;

At our stage, all courses of action seem to involve unpleasantness. But this is the only way that occurs to me to resolve the mortgages problem at all without what amounts to another massive transfer by the State to those better able to afford it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Joseph</p>
<p><i>Over the medium to long term sure but not in the first couple of years when wages are trying to catch up frog-hops in inflation. It would cause cashflow problems as you get 2-3 mortgage hikes before a wage rise kicks in.</i></p>
<p>At our stage, all courses of action seem to involve unpleasantness. But this is the only way that occurs to me to resolve the mortgages problem at all without what amounts to another massive transfer by the State to those better able to afford it.</p>
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		<title>By: hoganmahew</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100045</link>
		<dc:creator>hoganmahew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 16:40:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100045</guid>
		<description>@Joseph
Over the medium term, the bond markets catch on and apply a penal rate of interest - once inflation starts, they expect more inflation than occurs until inflation is controlled again. Hence the ECB insistence on keeping inflation expectations in check. They are, I believe, talking about the bond market, not other market participants.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Joseph<br />
Over the medium term, the bond markets catch on and apply a penal rate of interest - once inflation starts, they expect more inflation than occurs until inflation is controlled again. Hence the ECB insistence on keeping inflation expectations in check. They are, I believe, talking about the bond market, not other market participants.</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100044</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 16:37:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100044</guid>
		<description>I'm not surprised to hear our erstwhile banking colleagues may have already frittered away the nprf. If it hasn't already gone, it will be going pretty soon as I can't see the IMF et al allowing us to sit on a pile on one hand while drawing down with the other. They will tell us to use our own first.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not surprised to hear our erstwhile banking colleagues may have already frittered away the nprf. If it hasn&#8217;t already gone, it will be going pretty soon as I can&#8217;t see the IMF et al allowing us to sit on a pile on one hand while drawing down with the other. They will tell us to use our own first.</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100043</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 16:31:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100043</guid>
		<description>@EWI - "it would help ease the private debt burden "

Over the medium to long term sure but not in the first couple of years when wages are trying to catch up frog-hops in inflation. It would cause cashflow problems as you get 2-3 mortgage hikes before a wage rise kicks in.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@EWI - &#8220;it would help ease the private debt burden &#8221;</p>
<p>Over the medium to long term sure but not in the first couple of years when wages are trying to catch up frog-hops in inflation. It would cause cashflow problems as you get 2-3 mortgage hikes before a wage rise kicks in.</p>
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		<title>By: EWI</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100041</link>
		<dc:creator>EWI</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 16:24:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100041</guid>
		<description>@ Joseph

&lt;i&gt;I assume that any inflating away of debt would also entail rising interest rates and even more people in Ireland being unable to afford to pay their mortgages?&lt;/i&gt;

My understanding of the conventional view of inflation is that it would help ease the private debt burden (including mortgages). The problem I guess for the likes of Gurdgiev in advocating this would be that it would "attack" capital in their eyes, so ist verboten.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Joseph</p>
<p><i>I assume that any inflating away of debt would also entail rising interest rates and even more people in Ireland being unable to afford to pay their mortgages?</i></p>
<p>My understanding of the conventional view of inflation is that it would help ease the private debt burden (including mortgages). The problem I guess for the likes of Gurdgiev in advocating this would be that it would &#8220;attack&#8221; capital in their eyes, so ist verboten.</p>
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		<title>By: hoganmahew</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100032</link>
		<dc:creator>hoganmahew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 15:38:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100032</guid>
		<description>The amount of collateral that is required on derivative positions, whether they are losing or not, is dependent on the rating of the bank that sold the derivative. Anglo, at least, sold a lot of derivatives (a trading book of some 200 bn euro notional). We used to get a split of what was 'buying' and what was 'selling', but that stopped with the 2007 Anglo accounts. Meanwhile, the notional size of the Anglo book jumped 70% 2007 over 2006 and another 70% 2008 over 2007. 

With the recent downgrade to junk of some, I imagine the Irish banks are all facing cash calls on their collateral.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The amount of collateral that is required on derivative positions, whether they are losing or not, is dependent on the rating of the bank that sold the derivative. Anglo, at least, sold a lot of derivatives (a trading book of some 200 bn euro notional). We used to get a split of what was &#8216;buying&#8217; and what was &#8217;selling&#8217;, but that stopped with the 2007 Anglo accounts. Meanwhile, the notional size of the Anglo book jumped 70% 2007 over 2006 and another 70% 2008 over 2007. </p>
<p>With the recent downgrade to junk of some, I imagine the Irish banks are all facing cash calls on their collateral.</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph Mary Plunkett</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100027</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph Mary Plunkett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 15:28:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100027</guid>
		<description>In the spirit of dignitas humanae (Rome 1965) there will be no anger we will learn, we will rebuild, no one must worry no one must be afraid

erratum humanum est</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the spirit of dignitas humanae (Rome 1965) there will be no anger we will learn, we will rebuild, no one must worry no one must be afraid</p>
<p>erratum humanum est</p>
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		<title>By: irishpancake</title>
		<link>http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100014</link>
		<dc:creator>irishpancake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Nov 2010 15:09:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/2010/11/28/banking-crisis-bondholders-and-the-single-currency-project/#comment-100014</guid>
		<description>Pat Rabbitt on RTE 1 This Week, 15 mins into prog, derivirives bomb-shell.

http://www.rte.ie/news/av/2010/1128/thisweek.html#&#38;autoplay=true</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pat Rabbitt on RTE 1 This Week, 15 mins into prog, derivirives bomb-shell.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.rte.ie/news/av/2010/1128/thisweek.html#&amp;autoplay=true" rel="nofollow">http://www.rte.ie/news/av/2010/1128/thisweek.html#&amp;autoplay=true</a></p>
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